@HandsHurtLoL@kbin.social

HandsHurtLoL

@HandsHurtLoL@kbin.social

Fiber arts. SoCal. Social justice. Snark.

Este perfil es de un servidor federado y podría estar incompleto. Explorar más contenido en la instancia original.

HandsHurtLoL,

Haven't even directed my browser to reddit since migrating to kbin in June, but it's never fulfilled the same dopamine hit for me. I've supplanted my online addiction with YouTube now, which because of what I flit past and what I actually pay attention to has been extremely educational because of the algorithm!

Pretty early on, I ended up becoming the head moderator for a magazine on kbin, which then made me feel an ethical sort of guilt about commenting there anymore, so really the only place I wanted to be part of the dialogue is now gone for me here on kbin. Our magazine has a much larger mirror community on lemmyworld, so our magazine is barely holding on by a thread even after an initial burst of new subscribers. Discussion is almost non-existent in the magazine, and I'm not sure if it's because we tried to instate common-sense community guidelines early, or if because we missed the momentum of growing userbase after the rexxit since most people migrated to lemmyworld instead of kbin.

I'm not even sure why I keep my account. (I know I sound like Eeyore from Winnie the Pooh in this post.)

HandsHurtLoL,

Ah - yikes. I was really not anticipating you seeing my mini pity party here, ernest. I know you and the team have been really working hard on kbin and I've seen massive changes with the modding panel and functions as a result of the latest instance update. I have a ton of respect for what you all are accomplishing on the fediverse and I was originally a very vocal early adopter after the first reddit migration in June. I trust that you all are shouldering a major responsibility with this instance, and I'm grateful for the fediverse at the very least. I hope when you read this you didn't get the sense that I had any criticisms of kbin as the particular user interface I use for the fediverse - just that even across the federated instances (mostly lemmyworld), my ability to doom scroll for hours a day outpaces the userbase.

I think I feel a personal sense of failure(?) or disappointment(?) that I wasn't able to usher in a similar sense of community and activity to the sub I moderate compared to reddit. I think moving over here, it felt like my sub would be the natural beneficiary of inheriting the volume of users and content that existed on reddit, but our mirror community on lemmyworld got the lion's share and it isn't even scratching former reddit heyday numbers. Also, the people in their community are... suspect. I don't care for the comments section.

I hope you didn't take umbrage to my comment. I'm eager to see what new features the kbin dev team will roll out.

HandsHurtLoL,

Yeah, it's a 100% self-imposed moratorium just because I don't want to appear to have a modding bias. There was a period where I was trying to enliven the community by posting a few articles each day, especially from sources not submitted to our mirror community on lemmyworld, but then my real life job was draining my soul for 3 straight months, so that endeavor fell by the wayside. Also, unless it's an article dumping on one key player, our user base doesn't tend to comment on news articles. It's a weird phenomenon I've observed.

I will add though that my hobby communities that I belong to never make it to my feed, which seems to imply that those communities are stagnant, too. I would probably comment more in those spaces, but it's rare that new threads are created, I guess.

HandsHurtLoL,

Can someone give me some perspective on the 100 API per minute versus 10 API per minute in terms of me - a dirty f'ing casual - trying to use reddit via a 3rd party app?

I get that API is when my 3PA is talking to the reddit server, but is that happening for, say, every post that loads up on my infinite scroll? Or every time I open a post to read comments?

In other words, would my usage need to be as slow as "don't browse more than 10 posts per minute" to have stayed in the free lane?

HandsHurtLoL,

Okay, this helps me a lot. In essence, as someone using a 3PA, I represent 1 API, so for wildly successful 3PAs like Apollo, we're not talking 1000 API per minute, we're talking like 500k API per minute.

This is interesting also as it pertains to what you said about bots. When I used reddit for knitting and crochet, there was a bot that a community member had created that would reference a website that we all got patterns from, and then would generate a comment with a direct link to that pattern's page. In the lead up to the blackout, the bot's maintainer (not creator) was still in the dark about whether that bot would be shut down or not because reddit provided very little clarity when asked specifically about that bot. That bot was probably called up just a few dozen times per hour, so I imagine it would have been allowed to continue operating, whereas bots for AutoMods in subs with millions of subscribers were probably pulling huge numbers of API.

Thanks for chipping in!

This July 4th, let's remember that unfair economic treatment was a major cause of the American Revolutionary War. Our revolt has this much in common. (kbin.social) en

There were numerous factors that led to the revolution, but a key one was unfair taxation. The British parliament was in a position of power and thought that they could behave with impunity for further profits....

HandsHurtLoL,

This is a reach.

This is the second time I've seen something on kbin trying to dress the reddit migration to the Fediverse up as some hugely patriotic thing.

We don't need that, we don't benefit from it. This is how you create demagogues. Don't infuse nationalism into the Fediverse. That is super problematic and I think you're going to be in for a rude awakening when you see how much more European the Fediverse is than reddit was.

HandsHurtLoL,

Extremely well said, and I would repost you to the bestof magazine if I didn't think bestof communities were lame.

As I keep reading about all of this unfolding, a phrase that keeps rattling around in my brain: oppositional defiance disorder.

I am not a doctor or psychiatrist so I am not being too serious by bringing it up, but I am facetiously curious about who has the worst ODD among all the players of this drama.

Is it Steve Huffman and his refusal to back down? Is it the rexxitors who jumped ship on June 12? Is it the redditors who stayed to troll Huffman and his edicts? Or is it the redditors who stayed and are crafting a bespoke cesspool in snoo's carapace?

What are your thoughts, @arotrios ?

HandsHurtLoL,

I also suspect that there were inconsistencies between pricing based on the 3rd party app in question. I don't mean that Apollo was being charged more (in proportion) for having a larger userbase compared to apps like Relay or narwhal, but that Apollo was being charged almost double per unit to access API than Relay or narwhal. I am reading between the lines of articles published two *weeks ago about this because it didn't make sense to me why these smaller apps would be able to afford the business model if Apollo had a $20M bill to pay in August.

What gets my goat is why didn't reddit ever just headhunt Christian or other 3PA developers and bring them into reddit corporate to build out their native app? That's what Google or Microsoft would have done to quash competition. Or, to be truly evil, hired Christian and then never let him work on apps again with both an NDA and a non-compete in place.

Huffman regularly calls reddit unprofitable with a heavy dose of ire, but I think there could have been a way to bring a reputable 3PA dev into the fold to keep the reddit native app at least comparable in UX.

HandsHurtLoL,

So, I was on reddit for over 11 years, but I didn't arrive there from Digg. I remember a big kerfuffle surrounding Huffman and his willingness to change critical comments, but I was fairly oblivious to the ramifications of all that. I think I was just largely enjoying the halcyon days of Pao where you didn't have to think about reddit's corporate structure too far beyond how skivvy Conde Nast was.

This current controversy I guess seemed more relevant to me because I exclusively used 3PA to access reddit. Back when I had iPhones, I was paying for one of the tiers of Apollo because I liked it so much. I am pretty sure I used to use alien blue way way back in the day. I used these mainly because reddit didn't have an app on offer at all at these times and reddit for mobile was just inoperably clunky to use. As a share of the market, I was already brand loyal by the time reddit finally saw the writing on the wall that there was a need for an app. Now that I'm on Android, I was using Infinity (mixed feelings there about the fact that Infinity kept operating and I've since migrated and deleted my reddit accounts). I still feel resolved in my decision to leave reddit out of the principle of it all, and solidarity with Christian's mistreatment even though my app of choice is apparently staying online.

You refer to the Tencent movement as a notable moment that shifted the course of reddit. Any other pivotal moments that come to mind for you @arotrios ?

HandsHurtLoL,

I had no idea that was the history involved. This makes more sense now why maybe reddit has a vendetta against quality developers. haha

HandsHurtLoL,

This is a fancy bookmark from wherever your browser is. I have the same "app" and so do people who use Firefox on iOS. What you're looking at is essentially the same thing as kbin on the mobile internet.

The apps in development will have other QoL features that will be more similar to Apollo (but I hope more similar to Infinity for Android).

While larger, more general communities are thriving on the Fediverse - I'm missing out on the niche communities (kbin.social) en

Gaming, news, tech, general literature. All of these are somewhat thriving, with a steady influx of posts and comments. At the same time, the userbase is sorely lacking for more niche communities. In my case it'd be stuff like poetry, yoga, religion, linguistics, meditation. Or many other communities I'd doubt they'd form a...

HandsHurtLoL,

I commiserate with you on this. I miss my crochet and knitting communities from reddit, but I did make the severance anyway. I also don't use my Facebook account at all, so I don't have an online fiber arts community anywhere.

I belong to a small social knitting group, but I'm the most advanced knitter there, so I don't feel like I have any outlets for finding and appreciating master knitters other than YouTube. But I only turn to YouTube for tutorials/entertainment, not for a sense of community.

HandsHurtLoL,

I am subbed to this already. This community almost exclusively participates via microblog, not threads, so none of their content comes to my front page. I can't change that that community operates that way. I don't care (yet) for the microblog portion of the Fediverse.

I'm subbed to every knitting community federated with kbin.

HandsHurtLoL,

Because I'm primarily a mobile user with a non-tech 9-to-5 job, I feel totally ill equipped to follow through with this, but I do hope more people feel empowered to go this route!

HandsHurtLoL,

I love that you get the reference in my username LOL

I am subbed to all the crochet magazines/communities that are federated with kbin, but now that I've replied to someone else it dawns on me that the real issue is that those communities participate via the microblog and not via threads. This is probably a major reason why I'm not seeing those communities as active.

I wonder if there isn't a way to get microblog content to appear on my front page along with new threads.

HandsHurtLoL,

Yeah this is my understanding of it: the knitting magazines I've found so far are just all Mastadon-related.

I don't care for the format of Twitter, so I don't see myself taking to Mastadon too well.

HandsHurtLoL,

Okay, it appears that I'm going to be the only dissenting opinion here.

The discussion around karma here is all centered on the SFW side of reddit, it appears. I used to operate on the NSFW side of reddit to find sexual partners. After I would make a post explaining the kind of connection I wanted to make, I would get like 150 offers over the course of 3 days, both over direct messages (orangered inbox) and chat requests (chattit).

I would only respond to users who had any sort of karma, post history, or more than just a few months on their account. My thought process was that I don't want to meet people who are 100% lurkers, I would favor people who had comment histories on normal subs and were contributing members in those communities (gave me hope they would be interesting conversationalists on the date), and I wanted to see some longevity in the account so that there was a clear sense of the decorum of old reddit versus all the sally-come-lately users.

ETA: I suspect that I was getting so many offers because I myself had made several submissions (lending to my own non-zero karma score) both text and photo and I had a long-standing account. I think I would have been viewed skeptically by everyone if my account was 3 days old and I had zero content, but was trawling for sex. That's how men show up with 2 kidneys but leave with 1 in the morning.

HandsHurtLoL,

If you're using kbin, the reputation is calculated between your boosts and downvotes. This is a flaw from how this instance tried to retool the platform, but will be rectified soon so that reputation will be the simple arithmetic of upvotes minus downvotes.

In other instances, the upvotes are called boosts, but here on kbin, the functionally of boosts is how your content is getting promoted in other instances, from what I understand. Boosts are like retweets on other users' activity feeds here in kbin.

As mentioned, this will be ironed out.

HandsHurtLoL,

Okay, but I honestly would have been okay if spez had announced that this would have gone into effect July 1 instead of API changes. I would have loved to live on reddit forever in a walled garden.

HandsHurtLoL,

Next bad decision: no usernames, you must use your actual government name and verify not by email, but with a photo or photoscan of a government-issued ID. This will be done in the name of cracking down on bots and troll farms, but will have the unintended consequence of driving off anyone with half a brain cell about how your internet history can come back to haunt you straight off the platform.

HandsHurtLoL,

Is there a master list somewhere of all the instances on these two platforms (is that the right word?): Lemmy and kbin. Beehaw defederated from us degenerates (don't blame them - wish I could start up an account there lol) so I'm not worried about all the instances of Beehaw at this time.

From what I'm seeing both in terms of the magazines/communities I see posts from, there are several instances of Lemmy but only kbin.social, so is kbin.chat the second kbin instance...ever?

HandsHurtLoL,

Bookmarked. Thank you!!

HandsHurtLoL,

This was my sentiment two weeks ago, and I made an "is anyone else sad?" post.

It eventually devolved into a "ding ding, the witch is dead!" situation!

HandsHurtLoL,

I mean, actual take-home-pay aside from running Apollo, I have no doubt that Christian will be head-hunted like all hell from so many tech companies. I bet his future is solid gold after this. =)

HandsHurtLoL,

@gpage @danbob @bionicjoey I've said in other threads that I would have gladly paid $3/month (assuming that even 20% of the reddit userbase would also be willing to pay, making this subscription so cheap) to keep the lights on at reddit - and hell, maybe even turn a profit - if that had been presented as an option before all this debacle.

But then someone replied to me scoffing about how this means not only would I be generating free content for the site, but also paying for the privilege to do so. My take is that if this created a gated online community of contributors, that's probably fine by me.

Now that humans are leaving by the droves, the chatter in the Fediverse is that AI bots will eventually be all that's left on reddit and a few humans who don't know they're talking to bots. But if being a participating member (submissions, comments) cost money, I think it would become cost prohibitive to run bot armies on a platform like reddit.

HandsHurtLoL,

I guess we will start to see an uptick of "r/subsIfellfor" posts after more closures in light of how frequently the subreddit-as-hashtag but was being used.

HandsHurtLoL,

I can't help but think that people who describe the Fediverse as complicated joined reddit after the redesign...

Kbin is exactly like an old, stripped down version of old.reddit.

hearing about reddit strike on the street (kbin.social) en

I was standing on the street today when a man and woman passed me. The man was heatedly explaining to the woman about the reddit strike. I overheard him say "It's the third largest subreddit...." and he was making hand gestures I could see as they walked past. (Which one is the third largest?)...

HandsHurtLoL,

As much as I (a woman) would love to find literallyanyone else in my real life to commiserate about reddit, I can't help but feel bad for the woman in this brief story! LOL

Also, since most of my colleagues and social contacts are women, I've been the person aggressively explaining and cornering them inadvertantly!

HandsHurtLoL,

I would have been willing to pay reddit $3 directly if it meant avoiding ads entirely before all of this blew up.

HandsHurtLoL,

Ehh, don't interpret me as being in favor of HOAs, but like, if $3 helped me connect with a huge userbase over the hobbies I enjoy, I'm willing to pay it to live in a gated online community.

My hobbies are not tech related. I have not found a new home or sense of community on kbin. That's just the reality of what I've lost by boycotting reddit on principle. In my offline world, I have paid to be a member of hobby communities just to offset the costs of organizing events and reserving group spaces. Arguably, I'm paying for the privilege to go there and "share content" through my presence. This isn't a big deal to me if I'm engaging the platform.

$3 would be a steal if I were a power user. $3 might be not worth it if I'm just a lurker.

banning and defederating communities (kbin.fedi.cr)

Hey all, I recently left reddit like many of you. I have a question regarding lemmy and the fediverse on the history of banning and defederation. I have noticed several posts calling for varying communities to be disconnected. were these removal requests as prevalent before the mass migration? Usually I am all for communities...

HandsHurtLoL,

I am hoping that the new users are coming here with the intent to learn how this community works, before we try to remake the community we just left.

I counter this part of your post by throwing in there that for me and my time on reddit, the worst parts of the broader experience were the fact that communities of neo-nazis (r/conservative, r/conspiracy), Donald Trump cultists (r/the Donald), incels (numerous subreddits including r/incels and r/theredpill), and pedophiles (r/just18 among other porn based subreddits that were quarantined and banned several years ago) were allowed their own communities on the platform for as long as they were. This gave these horrible ideas time to draw attention and build a userbase that then degraded the quality of reddit across multiple other communities.

If kbin or lemmyworld immediately start banning or defederating these instances or communities/magazines, then to me that is how this larger community works and it is inherently not former redditors migrating here to shape the Fediverse in the image of reddit.

HandsHurtLoL,

I'm surprised you're referencing Geocities and MySpace because your post really smacks of young-person naivete.

You're severely overlooking overhead costs and multiple revenue streams for reddit in terms of profitability. Yes, it costs money to employ people, but servers and data costs money too. I remember when reddit was NOT its own photo and video hosting site, and everything that was posted as OC was hosted on imgur, flickr, Facebook, YouTube, Vimeo, and other content hosting websites that were prepared to scale. Instead of defending why Spez has to find more money, why is cutting costs for probably reddit's biggest expense not on the table? Seems to me that reddit took on all the cost and liability of content hosting without there being any asset to the website for doing so.

Additionally, there are multiple revenue streams for reddit. Yes, ad revenue is one thing, but also reddit coins were another stream. I can't even remember the layout of the reddit webpage right now because it's been so long since I've logged in on a laptop, but does anyone else remember the years in which every day, the front page had a progress bar of how much of the daily cost for reddit had been met through the purchase of reddit coins?? Why didn't reddit just become a subscription model? I would have gladly paid $3/month to keep the lights on. Multiply $3 by the massively addictive nature of reddit and its multiple million userbase, and reddit could have set the Guinness book world record for social media profitability.

HandsHurtLoL,

What do you gain by going to bat so hard for someone who doesn't even know you exist? To be so loyal that you're required to go into mental contortions to explain away the facts presented to you so that you can find the most generous rendition of what's going on?

HandsHurtLoL,

Yes! For me, it was extremely effective at its primary goal of being a content aggregator. I kept up with sooooo much news that was thematicly linked (national news, world news, politics, specific country's news/politics) that I could be the smartest person in most rooms I occupied in irl.

I think though that the corresponding magazines will be the first massly populated here on kbin.

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